Discipline
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@mpointon, No it was a white guy, I think it was Mike Mangini, endorser for Ziljian.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oD7v2sTr1Es. Was lucky to see more interesting clinics by Dennis Chamber and the great Dave Weckl .Like Carter Beauford a lot from your list, now I know what you mean by fills at the end of 8 bars!:)
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Joined: 23 juil. 2016
fanne wrote:
I’m not a drummer but sometimes I have the same issues with overdoing a song. It’s kind of hard to restrain yourself to what a song really needs and keep away the ballast, which may be beautiful on its own, but does not add any value to the song. Lack of discipline too .It happens when I write an arrangement for a song, sometimes I’m completely satisfied with my work: beautiful countermelody’s from the strings, perfect accents from the brass to give it some flow, nice coloring from the woodwind, all perfect…then I change my focus to the song and not the arrangement….oh my, too busy, way too much melodies pushing away the main melody of the song, overlapping’s in the low register ,the woodwinds…nowhere to be heard…the song is completely hijacked by the arrangement.
A while ago I wrote some beautiful strings and did some coloring for a song, it came back..Nice but a pinch too much strings, reworked it, came back..Better, but maybe…threw away almost all the strings…Yea,yeah,but….deleted the whole string arrangement…Wow! Just perfect! What an arrangement!
Some people just can’t put their finger on what is wrong in a song, but have an unbelievable feeling for what a song really needs.
)
I’m not a drummer but sometimes I have the same issues with overdoing a song. It’s kind of hard to restrain yourself to what a song really needs and keep away the ballast, which may be beautiful on its own, but does not add any value to the song. Lack of discipline too .It happens when I write an arrangement for a song, sometimes I’m completely satisfied with my work: beautiful countermelody’s from the strings, perfect accents from the brass to give it some flow, nice coloring from the woodwind, all perfect…then I change my focus to the song and not the arrangement….oh my, too busy, way too much melodies pushing away the main melody of the song, overlapping’s in the low register ,the woodwinds…nowhere to be heard…the song is completely hijacked by the arrangement.
A while ago I wrote some beautiful strings and did some coloring for a song, it came back..Nice but a pinch too much strings, reworked it, came back..Better, but maybe…threw away almost all the strings…Yea,yeah,but….deleted the whole string arrangement…Wow! Just perfect! What an arrangement!
Some people just can’t put their finger on what is wrong in a song, but have an unbelievable feeling for what a song really needs.
)
So true ! :D I feel better and less alone when reading you John... We both walk on the same path.
The arrangements are really hard to do. The question of dosage is a real question. Sometimes I give myself time to "forget" my additions, and I come back several days later to listen with my new ears ...
Sometimes, too, long months after adding, I tell myself that I could have done things differently ... So what prevents me to do it again?
But, I also think that we must know stop in editing a song, otherwise you always keep the idea that you can never finish anything. So we could be an eternal dissatisfied person, as Pierre Bonnard, this painter who was expelled from museums where his works were exhibited because he returned to museums with his brushes to retouch his paintings ... lol Poor Pierre :|
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Joined: 2 avr. 2016
@mpointon: Yes it's the classic 'less is more'. It reminds me of the Quincy Jones Michael Jackson albums. The drums on there are super-simple, and there is hardly a fill+cymbal crash to be heard anywhere. I think QJ actually removed cymbals from the drummers' kits. Here's a great example of super-simple, rock-solid drumming, with pretty much no fills, and no cymbals at all: https://youtu.be/ZorRGrDiMsA
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Posts: 522
Joined: 27 févr. 2015
nadrek wrote:[i]
@mpointon: Yes it's the classic 'less is more'. It reminds me of the Quincy Jones Michael Jackson albums. The drums on there are super-simple, and there is hardly a fill+cymbal crash to be heard anywhere. I think QJ actually removed cymbals from the drummers' kits. Here's a great example of super-simple, rock-solid drumming, with pretty much no fills, and no cymbals at all: https://youtu.be/ZorRGrDiMsA
[/i]@mpointon: Yes it's the classic 'less is more'. It reminds me of the Quincy Jones Michael Jackson albums. The drums on there are super-simple, and there is hardly a fill+cymbal crash to be heard anywhere. I think QJ actually removed cymbals from the drummers' kits. Here's a great example of super-simple, rock-solid drumming, with pretty much no fills, and no cymbals at all: https://youtu.be/ZorRGrDiMsA
Absolutely! MJ is a fantastic example. I regularly had to play Billy Jean in a covers band - so easy to 'overplay' it.
And this is the point I guess I was making: I know what to play, I understand restraint, I'm just terrible at executing it. I've lost count of the number of loops I've listened back to where I've gone, 'why did I play that? It was totally uneccesary!').
If you fancy a laugh, here's yours truly standing in for a function band way back in 2014 doing Billie Jean. The concentration needed to keep it simple is surprising! (By the way, I'm not sight-reading - I'm not that good - I have lyrics with cue points, phrases and changeovers written on them!)
[youtube]LkBxg1on-iw[/youtube]
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